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HomeMy WebLinkAbout06-23-08-WS ~ ~HILLS Approved: July 14, 2008 CITY OF ARDEN HILLS, MINNESOTA CITY COUNCIL WORKSESSION MEETING JUNE 23, 2008 6:15 P.M. - ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL Pursuant to due call and notice thereof: Mayor Stan Harpstead called to order the City Council Work Session meeting at 6: 15 p.m. Present: Mayor Stan Harpstead; Council Members Fran Holmes, and David McClung. Absent: Council Member David Grant and Brenda Holden (Excused). Also present: City Administrator Ronald J. Moorse and Assistant City Administrator Noah Simon. 1. APPROVAL OF SPECIAL MEETING AGENDA Councilmember Holmes requested an addition to Council Comments: Update on Highways 10 and 96. Mayor Harpstead requested the addition of the following agenda items under Council Comments: Update on Meeting with Jim Willis and Metro Cities Request for Committee Appointment. MOTION: Mayor Harpstead moved and Councilmember Holmes seconded a motion to approve the Work Session meeting agenda, as amended. The motion carried unanimously (3-0). 2. AGENDA ITEMS A. Review of TCAAP Work Plan and Schedule City Administrator Moorse presented a schedule indicating the correct times for upcoming work sessions to be held on non-Council meeting nights. He noted that at the June 30, 2008 regular City Council meeting, the Local Access Interchange concept will be presented to the Council for approval. A special TCAAP work session will be held before the July 14, 2008 Council meeting to meet with Ryan who has been working on updating financial information regarding the project. Stacie Kvilvang of Ehlers & Associates has also been working with Ryan on this matter. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 2 Councilmember ~cClung asked if this relates to the 1,750 housing units and noted it was Council's direction at the meeting to also have them reduce the commercial density by 200/0. He asked what they will bring to that meeting in terms of the commercial portion. City Administrator Moorse stated he thought the commercial would not be 20% reduced but the financial information would reflect 1,750 housing units. City Administrator Moorse stated at the July 14, 2008 meeting, the Council will review the prepared financials from Ryan. City Administrator Moorse advised that at the regular July 14, 2008 Council meeting, staff will initiate discussion to rename the TCAAP property. He indicated Ryan's marketing staff has developed three naming options for presentation to the Council along with background regarding the process used to select the naming options. Mayor Harpstead stated about one year ago, a resident provided name suggestions and he will provide that information to staff so it can be included. Councilmember McClung asked how long Ryan has been working on the naming options. He stated he always envisioned the naming process would be a joint endeavor between the Council and Ryan so this was a surprise from his perspective. City Administrator Moorse stated he has no more background on the naming process other than to know they have been working on it, taken into account the historical issues, and have prepared three options. Mayor Harpstead stated Ryan may have taken direction from one of Councilmember Grant's comments. Councilmember McClung stated his impression was that Ryan was working in cooperation with the Council on the naming process. Mayor Harpstead asked staff to be sensitive to the Council's stance. Councilmember Holmes stated her confusion about the meeting start times. She thought on July 14, 2008 there would be three meetings and asked if the renaming of TCAAP would be at 5 :00 p.m. or 7 :00 p.m. City Administrator Moorse clarified the renaming discussion will occur at 7:00 p.m. so it is known by the public that this process is underway and how the three name options were derived. The financial discussion will occur at 5:00 p.m. City Administrator Moorse stated on July 16, 2008 a TCAAP work session will be held to discuss how to proceed with the Master Plan process. On July 21, 2008, the Council will have additional discussions on the financial return information and additional discussion held on renaming. He noted that July 21, 2008 is a regular work session night so it will need to be determined how much time can be spent on TCAAP discussions. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 3 City Administrator Moorse noted that the July 28, 2008, 5:00 p.m., special TCAAP work session will be closed so environmental attorney Michael Comodeca can provide an update on the hazardous materials associated with building and those related costs and credits. Also, the remediation information will be presented during that closed session. City Administrator Moorse stated the July 28, 2008, 6:00 p.m. work session will include discussion of public relations and the release of information. An update on the transfer documents will be discussed on July 28 and July 29, 2008 between the attorneys, for the City, developer and the Army. City Administrator Moorse stated at the July 28, 2008, regular meeting, the Council will make a decision on the TCAAP name. At the August 11, 2008 Special TCAAP work session, an additional update on the financials and discussion on the Master Plan are scheduled. The Resource Study presents what type of resources will be needed as TCAAP develops so the financials will be the major focus during July, the Master Plan process during July and August, and the Resource Study will start in August and continue. Mayor Harpstead asked if additional budget meetings will be needed. City Administrator Moorse stated they would like that discussion scheduled on August 4, 2008 but Councilmember Holden will not be available so another date will need to be used for budget work sessions. Mayor Harpstead asked when the AUAR will start. City Administrator Moorse stated a lot of the AUAR work has been completed so discussion on the process will consider what remains to be done and how it will be completed. Mayor Harpstead asked when land use and the Land Use Concept Plan will be discussed as opposed to the Infrastructure Plan. City Administrator Moorse stated that was contained in the Master Plan process. Mayor Harpstead stated it was his desire to re-engage the people who put the Master Plan process together; especially if there have been significant changes. In addition, the Planning Commission needs to be involved with the Master Plan. Councilmember Holmes agreed with the need to involve the Planning Commission. Mayor Harpstead stated the issue of parks also needs to be addressed within the Master Plan. Councilmember McClung agreed there are several sub-topics under the Master Plan; such has density, which will involve large discussions and need to be included. He asked if staff is comfortable with the schedule of meetings that the City will complete this process by the third quarter of 2009. He also asked if the schedule of meetings will meet that closing date. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 4 City Administrator Moorse stated he is comfortable that the schedule of meetings is sufficient to meet the September, 2009 deadline. Mayor Harpstead noted the presentation of the Master Plan is scheduled for July 16, 2008 and approval of the Master Plan was scheduled for the end of December. Councilmember Holmes asked if there will be a more detailed schedule on the items to be presented on each date. City Administrator Moorse answered in the affirmative. Councilmember McClung noted it has been a tradition for the Council to cut back on meetings in December. He stated his personal preference would be to consolidate meetings, and have them go longer into the evening. City Administrator Moorse stated Staff met with an IT person to talk about calendars and organization. They looked at Sharepoint, an easy program to keep the Council and staff up-to- speed on the meeting calendar. The Council discussed the process of using Sharepoint. Assistant City Administrator Simon explained that a user ID and password will be provided to the Councilmembers so they can access the meeting schedule and topic information. Councilmember McClung stated he already feels like he is wearing a "straight jacket" with regard to maintaining three work-related schedules and is unsure whether he wants an additional calendar to maintain. Mayor Harpstead asked staff to poll the two absent Councilmembers to get their thoughts about using web-based Sharepoint. He stated he is willing to try Sharepoint and noted that even if several Councilmembers are able to make use of it, it will help staff. Councilmember McClung stated he will reserve judgment at this point. B. Discuss the Process to Facilitate the Council's Decision-makin2: Re2ardin2 the Residential Component of the Development City Administrator Moorse stated this is the next phase of planning and much broader than the housing element, but does include the housing component. It relates to the density, higher density versus lower density, type of housing, etc. He noted the staff report background information along with how the Council may want to move forward. City Administrator Moorse stated he had a short discussion with Gen McJilton from the Ryan Companies that in 2007 the Council went through a process to solicit their ideas and perspectives on the type of development they would like to see. In general, staff now has a concept plan that shows the types of uses being considered and where they will be located. This has been helpful because based on those uses and locations, the type of infrastructure can be determined and Ryan ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 5 can consider the financial feasibility. The next step in the planning process is to consider the desired character of the area or how the area can become a unique and special place. City Administrator Moorse stated it is important for each of the Councilmembers to provide input regarding what is most valued in terms of the housing and commercial components and how they relate to each other including parks, amenities, and trails. Once identified, the priorities can be determined. Mayor Harpstead stated this can be revisited but has been done a number of times involving two groups over the last ten years so there is a lot of history. The first group included input from the community and surrounding communities. Later fatal flaws were identified in that plan because 100 acres were not properly accounted for. Mayor Harpstead indicated the most recent concept plan focused on residents of Arden Hills and input was provided by residents from all comers of the City that represented different interests. Then a new architect was used and out of that a less expensive infrastructure was developed. However, unanswered questions remained related to the underlying contamination, water treatment facilities, and specific densities were not identified. At that point, the question of access to the property became the focus. Several meaningful meetings were held and the Council met with Ryan to ask what it means to have buildings with elevation. Input indicated that while some would be comfortable with six-level units in certain areas, others were not comfortable. Parking structures were also discussed.in the light industrial and retail areas. Mayor Harpstead explained that Council was not interested in having several big-box retail spaces but one big box space may be appropriate. With regard to housing, single-family housing was encouraged with a variety of lot sizes to create spread on affordability. Townhomes and manor homes were also discussed with some on the Council supporting them but others not supporting that type of housing. Discussion also occurred regarding apartments and the trade-offs between owner-occupied housing versus non-owner-occupied housing with a difference of opinion expressed by the CounciL Mayor Harpstead stated those discussions were very helpful because they involved Ryan, a consultant, and the Planning Commission. The location, nature and size of the parks was another land use discussion that was concerning in that some felt they were too small and disbursed. Councilmember McClung stated the Council started discussion on some of these issues as part of the Master Plan process but the Council did not have the opportunity to actually make a decision. He agreed with Mayor Harpstead that there have been a lot of useful discussions but only one or two general talks with nothing really being "put to bed." M,ayor Harpstead noted at that time the Council was not at a point to vote on a Concept Plan. Councilmember McClung stated he remains concerned there may be other topics of discussion that need to occur. He asked staff if they are referring to the "big picture" view in that this is a once in a lifetime opportunity. He stated that may have occurred at one point in the past but he does not recall the outcome of that past discussion but believes the Council delved more into the middle level, the nitty-gritty in how this can be accomplished. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 6 Mayor Harpstead stated discussions have occurred and. sometimes decisions have been made on behalf of the City. He stated the Council has remained committed to the spirit of the Vento Plan, a mixed-use community. Councilmember McClung stated he thinks that is only one small portion of the broad vision for the potential of this project. Councilmember Holmes stated the Council has determined where the residential areas should be placed and asked if it is being suggested that the Council should revisit that issue. She stated her impression was that the Council has moved beyond that issue. Councilmember McClung asked what the goal for that site is. Mayor Harpstead agreed with Councilmember Holmes that the Council has made that decision and moved beyond that point. Councilmember McClung stated he has not moved beyond that point and asked what each member of the Council wants to see on this site and what their broad goals and visions are for this site. Mayor Harpstead asked ifhis concern is mixed use. Councilmember McClung stated the Council has not identified what mixed-use would contain. Councilmember Holmes stated that mixed use has been defined. Councilmember McClung stated this could involve a lot of concepts and asked what mixed use would look like on this site. Councilmember Holmes stated she thought the Council had reached agreement on what that would look like even though the number of apartment units and location may not yet have been identified. Mayor Harpstead stated two parcels of land were set aside. Of the remaining acreage, 160 acres would be used for retail and light industrial predominantly on the western side and that 160 acres would be used for retail on the eastern side. Councilmember McClung stated this is a once in a lifetime opportunity but that sounds like any development. He asked how this will be unique. Mayor Harpstead noted the water feature was discussed as being unique but with regard to expenditures, the Council backed off on regional draw amenities like the outdoor performance areas and migrated to more of a utilitarian type of environment in keeping with the natural attributes of the community. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 7 Councilmember McClung stated that this was a vision of the site but may not yet have been announced to the public. Councilmember Holmes stated she would not like this discussed without the full Council in attendance. She stated she does not want to start again from scratch. Councilmember McClung stated he does not want to start from scratch but is concerned about "hanging a hat" on mixed use, which is hard to define. Councilmember Holmes stated it is past that point and decisions have been made but she agreed that questions on the number of apartments and density need to be addressed. She noted the Council has moved beyond the initial concept stage and identified uses and locations. Councilmember McClung asked if the Council was comfortable with approving a development that is the same as would be approved in any other municipal area. Councilmember Holmes answered in the affirmative, noting this project has been discussed for the past ten years. Councilmember McClung stated that is important to know. City Administrator Moorse noted the Council has determined the use of certain areas and has reached an agreement on that general concept. Now the discussion turns to the design phase and it needs to be determined how to do it in a unique way. He noted the Council mentioned such phrases as: sustainable, walkable, pedestrian friendly, open space amenities, landscaping, how to connect the residential and commercial areas, and other design elements. He stated these are big design questions that will impact how the commercial areas are developed and will need to be addressed. However, it does not mean the Council has to go back to the beginning. Mayor Harpstead noted some design elements . remain and the Council still has the capacity, if funding is available, to introduce some novelty and uniqueness. However, the Council has been reluctant to consider the cost. Mayor Harpstead indicated there is the possibility to use TIF to provide community benefit. However, the Council has not yet identified other funding sources. He noted the concept work to date does not need to be thrown out at this point and discussion can occur on how to create design elements, some of which need financing. City Administrator Moorse stated his interest is to have a discussion on what would make this project special and unique. He stated he is not just talking about a specific amenity, but how it can all work together to make it more special than can be found in any city with a 500-acre project. Councilmember Holmes noted that amenItIes have a financial bearing on the City so the financial discussion needs to go hand-in-hand with the planning concept discussion. City Administrator Moorse stated a discussion of how to create an amenity, without giving up green space, needs to be held. He noted the Council needs to determine what is more important, and perhaps green space can be created by allowing higher density. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 8 Councilmember McClung stated he would have liked more time prior to discussion of financials and financial impacts to identify potential amenities and then put the financial discussion on top of it. City Administrator Moorse noted the Council is not at the end of the process and there will be opportunities to discuss the concept plan and design, but first financials will be discussed. Councilmember McClung stated his concern that the Council has already talked themselves out of amenities, such as a larger water feature. Councilmember Holmes stated the water feature is up for discussion and she has not personally identified the size of the water feature. Mayor Harpstead stated the Council did set the direction with its negotiating team by indicating to staff that it does not want a large water feature the size of the Edina water feature so some direction has already been given. Councilmember Holmes stated there is a new plan and it seems the water feature is smaller. Mayor Harpstead stated it is important through this process to say whether you want to see more or less. City Administrator Moorse encouraged the Council to go beyond saying that they want a larger water feature, but to also identify why they want a larger water feature, such as to create a gathering place. Councilmember Holmes agreed and stated issues remain with the roads or if a bridge is needed. She stated the Council has already identified reasons why. Mayor Harpstead agreed and stated the Council also identified why they did or did not like certain elements on drawings or features being presented by the architect. Councilmember Holmes noted the last plan that was presented identified larger sized parks, which was a change. Mayor Harpstead agreed and commented on the importance of identifying those amenities. Mayor Harpstead asked whether the Maxfield data was "bounced off' the concept plan and discussed from a residential standpoint. Councilmember Holmes stated she recalled that they decreased the number of townhomes because of the Maxfield data. Councilmember McClung stated there may have been some discussions, but no conclusions were reached. He stated he thought Ryan was going to take some townhomes out of the equation. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 9 Councilmember Holmes stated it may not have been decided but the Maxfield data was being considered. Assistant City Administrator Simon suggested the Council hold a conversation to determine the amenities it supports and determine how they add value. Mayor Harpstead stated he remembers an overhead slide identifying other land uses that would fit on a property of this size and the area that would be left over. He stated it has the potential to say, ~~I want it all" which he believes would be dangerous because it would be too much. He stated he does not know if it would be of value to go back and brainstorm on what you want on the parcel. Rather, he believes a discussion of specific details and design elements would be more helpfuL Councilmember Holmes agreed that it is time to move on to the detail of the development or it will never be approved on time. Councilmember McClung stated he thinks it will be a nice high-class development that you could have anywhere but he personally would like more than that. Mayor Harpstead encouraged him to find a way to articulate that opinion and provide examples. Councilmember Holmes asked if there is some commitment to previous input, noting staff is moving forward with plans based on past comments. Mayor Harpstead agreed the Council has given staff guidance; however, if there is something not yet thought about, he would be willing to consider it. City Administrator Moorse stated the "details" of the development makes him think about not so much what any feature should look like, or how big it should be, but and what it would accomplish. Mayor Harpstead stated he is comfortable with the residential concept and number of townhouses, with some being converted to senior housing, and supports smaller lot sizes for some single-family homes. He pointed out that the Council also needs to discuss the density of residential units and how that meshes with affordability. That may relate to individual parcels of land as opposed to large blocks of land. On the industrial side, he would like to know the square footage of retail and major retail uses. Mayor Harpstead noted that some have commented on the need for less office/warehouse and more office. However, he believes the market will drive a lot of that and an amendment to the Master Development Agreement could be considered, when needed, based on the market. He stated he did ask what it means to have 42 units per acre in an apartment building and what that would look like. Councilmember McClung agreed the Council requested visuals of an area of the site and what the block would look like but was told to go look at a development in a certain area. He stated it would be nice to see an artist rendering and three dimensions of what it would look like on this site. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 10 Mayor Harpstead noted the highest density in Arden Hills is 22 or 25 units per acre but he would like to see an example of what 42 units per acre would look like. He pointed out that the development mentioned in Lexington Apartments in Roseville equals about 35 units per acre in a three-story building. Councilmember McClung stated it would be nice to have an example for all the colored areas identified on the map for the residents to review. City Administrator Moorse stated it may be done differently based on the open space surrounding the different density areas. Councilmember Holmes stated the extent of the area (number of blocks) also needs to be known along with the number of blocks involved in the development. Cheryl Fish, audience member, asked if everything will look the same, as done near the athletic fields in Blaine. Mayor Harpstead stated the Council toured various developments and that is one of the things they asked when they first started the process. In Apple Valley they looked at a development where all the homes looked alike but the Council indicated they wanted variety. Beverly Togel, audience member, suggested uses such as a flower shop, dress shop, shoe shop, ice cream shop, and other small shops that people can visit. Mayor Harpstead stated that has been discussed in terms of the retail but that hasn't been defined. He advised that one of the first developments will be an identified retailer and then it will need to be discussed how to incorporate retail into residential. He stated the Council has been warned that two-story retail with residential on top does not work well. Russ Adams, audience member, stated almost anywhere that there is a tall commercial building, it will not cast a shadow on residential units. He stated that is a huge issue when considering the aesthetics of tall buildings. Mayor Harpstead stated it was Council's consensus to be more flexible with regard to height but there was not as much flexibility with regard to density. Chuck Mertensotto, audience member, stated that Chaska has interesting housing and other developments, such as Clover Ridge, that includes commercial on the lower level with residential on top. He reviewed several other types of unique projects. Mayor Harpstead noted that Arden Hills has not yet gone through this process and is still gaining knowledge through examples from other projects. Lyle Salmela, audience member, stated the issue of energy conservation needs to be addressed in the overall plan. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 11 Mayor Harpstead noted that community open houses were held and input was received relating to the water feature size and location. He noted Centennial Lakes has areas with highly sculptured rock walls and entertainment-type areas but that did not get many votes in Arden Hills, and neither did the storm pond option. Votes were more along the middle. However, one area can be more reminiscent of Centennial Lakes. He stated the vote should not have been all or nothing but, rather, a mix based on percentages. Mayor Harpstead stated it may be beneficial to the City Administrator and Assistant City Administrator to be briefed by Hoisington who were the architects on behalf of the developer. Councilmember Holmes stated it would be helpful to come up with different areas to discuss in more detail (water feature, roads, and parks) and allocate the topics to different meetings to assure the discussion remains focused. Mayor Harpstead stated it is also important to focus the discussion on trade-offs, what is the most important, during negotiations of the final Master Plan. City Administrator Moorse stated there may be opportunities to create a win-win situation with the developer as well. 3. COUNCIL COMMENTS A. Comment about the Hi2hwavs 10 and 96 Proiect Councilmember Holmes stated that she noticed, as did Councilmember Holden, that the bridge seems too wide and the curvature too big going to the north. She stated if the Council was to vote on this matter next week, more information was needed on the number of lanes and turn lanes. City Administrator Moorse stated he asked that specific information from Bolton & Menk and their response was that it was not more narrow east to west because it would be pushed into Arden Manor. Therefore, a double left-hand turn lane was needed to avoid traffic backups. Councilmember McClung stated it would be helpful to have the traffic numbers based on this proposal. Mayor Harpstead stated Bolton & Menk will be in attendance and will be prepared to answer that question. at the Council meeting. Councilmember McClung stated he would like the answer to be provided prior to the Council meeting in case another question and response is needed. Council consensus was reached that Bolton & Menk be asked this question before the meeting and whether there are other options. Discussion ensured regarding the different turning movements that can be made at this intersection and that Bolton & Menk will be asked whether the bridge has been designed at the minimum radius needed. ARDEN HILLS CITY COUNCIL WORK SESSION - JUNE 23, 2008 12 Beverly Togel, audience member, asked whether the water park will be open for kids to play in. Mayor Harpstead indicated this has not been determined but that it is about 10 acres in size, within a public space. However, it was not intended to be an entertainment water park, but more of a water feature inside a City park. B. Update on Meetin2 with Former Interim City Administrator Jim Willis Mayor Harpstead reported he talked with Jim Willis who proposed three meeting dates. He asked the Council to check their schedules and inform staff whether they could meet with Jim Willis from 5:00 p.m. to 6:30 p.m. on either July 7, or July 9, or before the PTRC picnic meeting on July 15, 2008. C. Metro Cities Request for Committee Appointment Mayor Harpstead advised of the July 14, 2008 application deadline for the Committee appointment. The committee is involved with grant evaluation and ranking, in regard to the County Transit Improvement Board. He asked if any Council member would like to apply for appointment to this committee, noting Ramsey County has two positions open at this time. No one expressed an interest. D. Responses from Chief Boehlke Councilmember McClung stated after the work session last week, Chief Boehlke e-mailed responses to several follow-up questions, which he forwarded to the City Administrator. It will be provided for Council review in the next several weeks. ADJOURN MOTION: Councilmember McClung moved and Councilmember Holmes seconded a motion toadjoum the Special City Council Meeting. The motion carried unanimously (3- 0).