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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2002-09-03 P & ZCITY OF CENTERVILLE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION SEPTEMBER 3, 2002 Pursuant to due call and notice thereof, the Planning and Zoning Commission held their regularly scheduled meeting on September 3, 2002, at 6:30 p. m. PRESENT: Ray DeVine Tom Wilharber Mary Jo Helmbrecht Brian Hanson David Kilian John McLean ABSENT: None. COUNCIL: Council Member Travis STAFF: Ms. Moore-Sykes I. CALL TO ORDER 1.Roll Call The meeting was called to order at 6:32 p.m. II. PUBLIC HEARING(S) None. III. AWARDS/PRESENTATIONS/APPEARANCES None. IV. OLD BUSINESS 1.Right of Way Ordinance The Commission indicated they did not receive the right-of-way ordinance. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated the Ordinance provided was a model ordinance provided by the League of Minnesota Cities and approved by several local cities, including Ham Lake, Blaine, and Spring Lake Park. Commissioner DeVine indicated that the Commission has seen the model ordinance and had asked Staff to amend the model ordinance to reflect the language specific to Centerville. Commissioner DeVine pointed out there was discussion on Page 5 of 10 of the minutes from the July 2, 2002 meeting on the right-of-way ordinance. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated Staff would have an ordinance ready for review at the October meeting. Chair Hanson asked if the penalty in Ordinance #13 was retroactive. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that license holders would need to do a number of things when they renew their license in order to be allowed to participate in the best practices program. Commissioner DeVine asked what the benefits of being on the best practices would be. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated the biggest advantage would be a reduction in underage drinking along with better communication between license holders, the police department, and the City. Council Liaison Travis indicated the penalties for violations are not as harsh if they are on the best practices schedule. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated a third violation would mean that the license holder would revert to the regular penalty grid until they can prove that they are eligible for the best practices program. Commissioner Wilharber suggested the title should reflect that this new ordinance repeals the old Ordinance #13. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated the title allows for a better paper trail for future tracking of the changes made to the ordinance. V. NEW BUSINESS 1. Rescheduling November Meeting (General Election) Motion by Commissioner Wilharber, seconded by Commissioner DeVine to reschedule the November Planning Commission Meeting to November 4, 2002. All in favor. Motion carried unanimously. VI. DISCUSSION ITEMS 1. Encroachment/Zoning Permits/Fences (Ordinance #4) Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that City Staff has been inundated with questions concerning fencing and has found themselves being pulled into several neighborhood disputes. She then indicated she had met with the Staff and Staff would like the Commission to consider amending Ordinance #4 as the draft document shows. Commissioner DeVine asked if any other city requires a two-foot setback when permission cannot be obtained from the neighbor. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that the change is causing more problems because neighbors do not want to sign or those putting up fences do not want to ask for permission. She then said she feels that all fences should come before Staff and/or the Planning Commission to ensure that residents are determining where the property lines are. Commissioner Wilharber indicated he felt the fencing should be an administrative issue and not something the Planning Commission should deal with. Commissioner DeVine indicated he liked the way the Ordinance was amended by Staff but said that wording the ordinance in such a manner would require a homeowner to obtain a survey if an agreement could not be reached with the neighbor. Commissioner Wilharber indicated there is also an issue with the maintenance of the other side of the fence. Mr. Richard Thompson of 1657 Peltier Lake Drive addressed the Commission and explained what goose fencing was and asked whether the ordinance would cover that type of fencing. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated she did not feel that Ordinance #4 would govern goose fence because a fence is a barrier and a goose fence is only a barrier to the geese. Commissioner McLean suggested using the word permanent. Mr. Thompson asked if the goose fence could go back up if he takes out the other fencing. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that one section of Mr. Thompson’s fence would be grandfathered in. Mr. Thompson asked if he put the rails in at 45 degrees if that would be considered a fence or if that would be ornamental. Commissioner Kilian said he felt that would still be considered a fence. Chair Hanson suggested that a line of any sort should be visible so no one trips over it. Commissioner DeVine indicated he would be in favor of indicating that goose fencing is not regulated by Ordinance #4. Commissioner Wilharber suggested that it may be tough for residents to swallow having to pay for a land survey to put up a fence. He then said he would like some time to review and consider these suggested changes before making a decision. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that Mr. Palzer had said he wants the fences on the property lines and, if homeowners cannot agree on the property line, a survey will be needed. Mr. Thompson indicated he knows where the posts are but his neighbor has said he disagrees with their location. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated she had told Mr. Thompson’s neighbor that a survey should be done to eliminate the controversy as to the location of the property line. Commissioner DeVine indicated that he would not want City Staff out making determinations on property lines as that could open the City up to liability. He then said he would like to give the ordinance changes some more thought because a survey will be required in a lot of cases the way it is written. Commissioner McLean indicated it is in the property owner’s best interest to locate the property pins because that information will be needed at some time. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated that most cities charge $25.00 to $30.00 for a fence permit. Commissioner Kilian said he felt that $25.00 or $30.00 is too high as taxes are too high in Centerville already. Commissioner Helmbrecht indicated the Ordinance needed to address snow fence and goose fencing. Commissioner Wilharber asked if the City would be liable if someone uses a material for their goose fencing that is not clearly visible and someone trips because the Ordinance says that goose fencing is allowed. Chair Hanson said he feels that would be the homeowner’s responsibility. Chair Hanson suggested indicating in the Ordinance that a highly visible material needs to be used. Motion by Commissioner DeVine, seconded by Commissioner Kilian to table Ordinance #4 revisions to the next meeting. Ms. Moore-Sykes suggested adding language that the goose fencing should be completely contained on the homeowner’s own property. VOTE: All in favor. Motion carried unanimously. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated Staff would like to discuss accessory structures and uses and indicated she would put that on a future agenda for discussion. Commissioner McLean asked to have a discussion concerning total lot coverage added to a future agenda. Commissioner DeVine asked that a discussion regarding front porches be added to a future agenda. Mr. Thompson asked about parking on City streets over the curb. Ms. Moore-Sykes indicated she had addressed that today. She then said that Ordinance #16 states that it is not allowed. VII. CONSIDERATION OF MINUTES 1. August 6, 2002 Planning and Zoning Meeting Minutes Motion by Commissioner Wilharber, seconded by Commissioner DeVine to approve the August 6, 2002 Meeting Minutes as presented. All in favor. Motion carried unanimously. Commissioner Helmbrecht asked that the adult ordinance be placed on the agenda for review. VIII. ADJOURNMENT Motion by Commissioner Wilharber, seconded by Commissioner Kilian to adjourn the September 3, 2002 Planning Commission Meeting at 7:18 p.m. All in favor. Motion carried unanimously. Transcribed by: Joan Lenzmeier, Recording Secretary TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc.