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Special City Council Minutes - 12/04/03 Page 5 Deputy Fire Chief Chandler noted that in his twenty-four years of service to the Fire Department, it was a firefighter's perspective that those who had put in ten to twenty years had paid their dues and deserved relief funds. Deputy Fire Chief Chandler noted that the department looked at those with less than ten years of services as not having achieved their "benchmark." Deputy Fire Chief Chandler noted that he had come from a department previously where vesting had changed to five years, and people left the department after that time, causing more training and disruption issues in the department than making things overall better for the membership. Discussion included the department's estimated time for training (three years), followed by additional experience; increasing the unfunded liability issues faced by the City at this time with the Relief Association, rather than making changes when a surplus existed; vesting and maximum benefits realized; loss of valuable, experienced firefighters and department impacts; public safety considerations when inexperienced firefighters area not available; various levels of training experience within the department at this time; Mayor Kysylyczyn recognized a member of the audience to make public comment. Allen Carrier, 1040 County Road C2, former Firefighter for thirty (30) years, and Relief Association Trustee Mr. Carrier noted that the State had given the Association an option to reduce vesting to five years; and following debate, the Relief Association determined that ten years was more beneficial to the department to retain firefighters longer, allowing for more experience and training and overall safety for the membership and the public. Mayor Kysylyczyn questioned if society had changed, becoming more mobile due to job movement, and whether